Valandis Build

[I8A4RE]

Mate I dont know what your expecting? Im not saying you cant get any more but 28kw (around 33% increase) is excellent result and about right round were it should be. What were you expecting to achieve?

3rd is the right gear.

[Valandis91]

Mate I dont know what your expecting? Im not saying you cant get any more but 28kw (around 33% increase) is excellent result and about right round were it should be. What were you expecting to achieve?

3rd is the right gear.

but most people here have that already. i just dont get it. i was hoping at least 130kw.
i know the torque figure is insane but some more top end wouldve been good too.

[aza013]

Most mivec tips get 90-100kws stock so I can see why you would not be happy with it.

[I8A4RE]

Thats it they have it already.

Say someone dyno 100 at stock, then mods and get's 130. Thats a 30% increase in power. You have just gained a 36% increase. There is probably some more left but not much. If you want more power you are going to have to do manual conversion or turbo.

A 36% increase for a n/a tune with out touching the internals is very reasonably and you should be extremely happy with that. You cant compare your self to forced induction mate. For you to go from 76 to 130 would be a wopping 76% increase... Remember i only got 65 odd going the forced induction route.

[I8A4RE]

Most mivec tips get 90-100kws stock so I can see why you would not be happy with it.

Mine was only 79

[aza013]

I'm going for a 50% + increase NA and will get it too

what only 79! Interesting.

Valandis91 I wonder if somthig is not set right on the car, or as said chang over to a manual box.

[I8A4RE]

Yeah definitly achievable... a 50% increase for val is 114kw and I think he will get it.

and aza if I ever decide to manual (I never will though lol). Theres at least another 15kw just like that

[aza013]

Go on do it lol

[I8A4RE]

nah i love to sip my moccachito through peak hour traffic watching the people with manuals faces everytime we move 3 inches.... lol

[Valandis91]

I'm going for a 50% + increase NA and will get it too

what only 79! Interesting.

Valandis91 I wonder if somthig is not set right on the car, or as said chang over to a manual box.

wasnt yours a GR though simon? see yours wasnt even mivec and it got more than me. something must be up with the block of mine.

it did get cleaned out. maybe needs rebuilding. but will do it down the track.

the only thing is my ignition timing hasnt been touched. you can sorta tell its not right even from driving and the FPR hasnt even been tuned in. but i dont know how much extra im going to get from those 2.

how much NM of torque are you getting aza?

with the amount of mods i have and getting 36kw extra it just doesnt sound right.
i guess i just need to get it properly tuned and we'll see. at least the AFR's are right thanks to me!

[aza013]

I will have to find out what the torque readings are as I have not done a torque run for some time now.

[koolio1234]

Torque is what you want anyway. 30-50kw increase over stock is good enough if it means you have more torque.

[Shane001]

Torque is a multiplier of power and vice versa. Can't remember the formula but if you have one you can calculate the other. They are directly related. In fact I think any power readings provided from a dyno are actually calculated, as the dyno actually records torque (someone correct me if I've got this the wrong way around lol!).

Here u go

T = HP x 5252 / N

Where;
T = Torque (LbFt)
HP = Horsepower
N = Speed (rpm)

[mr-charisma]

This explains nicely.. if you can be bothered to get your head around it after a long day @ work ..

"torque is what gets us going, horsepower is what keeps us going".

Very true, but, there's a little more to it. Here are some basic facts taken from Turbododge:

1. The formula is: Torque x RPM / 5252 = Horsepower

2. Torque is the amount of twisting force the engine makes.

3. Horsepower is about speed or measuring how fast you get things done.

4. Horsepower is not a direct measurement; it has to be calculated by measuring TORQUE and RPM.

5. If you have big numbers (torque & rpm) you get big horsepower, if you have small numbers you get small horsepower; it is a numbers game in every way.

6. The number 5252 is very important besides being the formula constant.

For example:

5252 / 5252 = 1 that’s easy math, but read into it and you see in the formula that
Torque x 5252 / 5252 = Hp
They cancel each other out resulting in Torque x 1 = Horsepower; meaning that 300lbs of Torque = 300 Hp.

On the graph Torque & Horsepower intersect at 5252 rpm, they always do – mathematical fact.

Now we read deeper into 5252 with simple math: 4000 / 5252 < 1 so at 4000 rpm you’re multiplying torque by less than 1 and therefore have less Hp in the end.
300lbs x 4,000 rpm / 5252 = 228.48 Hp see, you started 300 and ended with 228

Fear not, Horsepower doesn’t always loose to torque, you have only seen examples below 5252 rpm, but now when we rev up and go above 5252 rpm the table turns and Horsepower rules the equations. 6000 / 5252 > 1 at 6000 rpm you’re multiplying torque by more than 1 and get more Hp in the end
300lbs x 6,000 rpm / 5252= 342.72 Hp you started with 300 and ended with 342
7. From this all this we can conclude that:
[5252 rpm is a crossing point

Below 5252 rpm Torque will always be greater

Above 5252 rpm Hp will always be greater

8. Because Horsepower is a numbers game it can be very misleading: 500Hp @10,000 rpm is very different from 500Hp @ 6,000 rpm. To figure out what the torque would be on both engines we need to solve for X (torque) by reversing the equation which would be Hp x 5252 / RPM = Torque
The first engine with 500Hp @10,000 rpm only makes 262.6 lbs of torque but

The second engine’s 500 Hp @ 6,000 rpm makes 437.66 lbs of torque that’s 175 lbs more and a way better engine"

[mr-charisma]

thanks shane I learned some new things

[Shane001]

Good job Mr Charisma

Explains it perfectly! Thankfully our little FTO's rev well beyond 5252rpm

(And some of us are still at work )

[Gholdwayne]

power is how fast you go till you hit the fence.

torque is how far you take the fence with you.

[Valandis91]

bit of n update.

trying to get some spare cash aside to get the ignition timing done.
still have to put up my latest dyno.

installed samco hoses yesterday and did a coolant flush. looks very nice!
didnt do power steering couldnt be bothered..

also gave her a wash. so shiny

attacked emanage wiring. its such a complicated mess down there.
except it took me half an hour to have the speed input hooked up.
i finally have a speed reading in datalog woo! makes it very handy.

couldnt be bothered checking the other wires too frustrating.

but im not longer restricted to 180

[Valandis91]

had nothing to do really today so thought i'd finally do a 0-100 time using the datalogging off the emanage.

Remember this car isnt tuned yet. Is tiptronic. Just not running right.

anyways. the first run i did. no launch did 0-100.... 6.9 seconds. dodgy slipping gear change from 1st to 2nd though
the tried again with loading the torque convertor to 2000rpm.
got 0-100 in 5.2 seconds with a quick good solid gear change as well.

i didnt realise it was that fast. im having difficulty finding the best way to change gears.....

if i keep my foot planted the gearbox sometimes slips due to the torque.
then if i lift off and plant it when it changes gear the wheels spin and i get major torque steer then the revs drop

due to the much larger profile on the non mivec cams it seems to struggle a bit due to being rich and ignition timing being off. but once mivec kicks in... wow. as mivec has only been increased a small amount.

hopefully get it tuned in the coming weeks. will keep updated.

[SG]

Yeah see, dodgy dyno hp readings

I think 6.9 is fast for a non launch and 5.2 is very fast for not having a lsd. Sounds like a lot of top end speed... I think if you took it to the drags as it is you might get an interesting time.

Do you think the torque converter is taking load when changing gears as if the brakes were on when standing still? Maybe the torque converter needs a bit of an adjustment do you reckon or a larger one put in?