Brainstorming..... RWD'ing an FTO

FtoSam · Post by **FtoSam** » Sun Aug 02, 2009 5:39 pm

Hey guys...

Looking into the technicalities of getting a rear diff into the FTO.

I am currently organising/making a rough budget for my next project car.

At this stage we're looking into a supercharged 1UZ v8 with an R154 Box for the front part. (This is a whole new car... not my current FTO)

Now getting the power figures im after from this engine is pretty easy... I have a housemate with specialities in the 1Jz/1Uz Engines and the R154... And obviously I have come to know a fair bit about the FTO and even a few ideas when i was looking at the AWD option..

So far the info is:
Buying a Rolling Shell of an FTO. To be stripped BARE
1UZ-FE Supercharged V8 4.0L 600hp+ Engine
Rebuilt R154 Supra 5 Speed Gear Box
Fuel Cell in the boot
Modified (cut for the R154) Firewall
Wide Rear end to house some 12" rears
I work for Mitsubishi/Toyota so parts can be sourced a bit cheaper

Now, im wondering what my options are with a rear end...

1) Use the rear end out of a Galant
2) AS above but EVO 4/5
3) Use something like a ford/supra diff
4) Custom?

Now im thinking with options 1 and 2, we have the advantage of they will be very close to something of a straight bolt up item.. however the drive shaft will have to be custom and may not like going from the R154 to the Galant/Evo Diff... As well as being able to handle big hp...

However with option 3, it is far more likely to handle the HP all day every day, and the driveshaft is much more likely to be an easy fit.... Downside is an arse load of custom rear end work... especially in suspension!

Just brainstorm with me here guys... let me know what you'd be looking at and if theres anything i'd be missing?

rock_it · Post by **rock_it** » Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:36 pm

I am not trying to be a smart ass... But why not just get a Supra.. All the rwd hard work is already done, and a ton of aftermarket parts...

I am all for doing something different, but if you put as much cash and effort into a rwd baseline to start with, you will have a 10 second car...

But just my opinion...

FtoSam · Post by **FtoSam** » Sun Aug 02, 2009 7:09 pm

Cause its been done....

I love FTOs... I want their looks with v8 grunt...

People expect that sort of sh*t from a supra...

Someone tells you about a 600hp 1UZ supra and you go... oh yeh... not bad...

Then you see someone slide round a drift track in an FTO with the rumble of a V8 combined with the whine of a supercharger and smoke pouring from the rear tyres....

They are in two completely different leagues...

End of why discussion...

J · Post by J » Sun Aug 02, 2009 7:30 pm

thats a monster of a project. whats your budget?

i'm guessing this is going to be a track based car?

scremn · Post by **scremn** » Sun Aug 02, 2009 7:32 pm

Love the idea mate, but man this is gonna be expensive!

I wouldnt bother with a Mitsi rear diff for a high power RWD setup, just custom make a rear subframe that solid mounts a Supra/Skyline diff and bolts up to the factory locations (You should be able to see these bolt holes in your chassis rails when you look under the back). Use Evo 3 AWD rear trailing arms with 5 stud hubs and get some custom driveshafts made to the right length.

Im real interested in what your planing in the front, search 'Team Orange Evo' if your looking for some idea's about North-South RWDing Mitsi's.

I really want a RWD Mitsi too, but I almost feel as if the best way is to just move the engine to the back seat

col2560 · Post by **col2560** » Sun Aug 02, 2009 9:02 pm

blower scoop out the bonnet??

mmmmmmm mental picture of a blown hemi in a fto, sweet !!!!!
it might sound "old school" but how about a Jag rear end? these rears have been fitted to more types of cars than almost anything else, and you can modify them to fit, also a range of ratio's available. you'll have to mini-tub the rear bodywork maybe???
you sound more like a hot rodder than a drifter.......
Man, I wanna see this when it's done !!!!!!

FtoSam · Post by **FtoSam** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:31 am

Well budget is very rough at this stage but:

- FTO Rolling Shell - $3000
- Shitter 1UZ "Trial" Engine - $1200
- Proper 1UZ with Supercharger built to 800hp - $21,000 (Already got the quote)
- Supra Rear Diff - $500
- Custom Made Tail Shaft - $2,500
- Reco'd and stronger R154 with triple plate clutch - $4000
- Evo/Galant Rear Halfcut - $2,500
- Billet Rims (17x9 inch front, 17x12inch rear) - $2,000 (Have sweet hookups)
- Fuel Cell for boot - $1,200
- Aluminium Radiator - $500
- Widebody arches (roughly 3-4inches) - $1,600
- Twin Fuel Pumps (Holleys) - $1,100
- Fully braided Lines (Fuel, Brakes, Oil) - $2,500
- RR FPR - $400
- ECU - $4,000
- Tuning - $1,500
- Engineers Report - $800
- Custom Extractors - $1,800
- Exhaust System - $1,500
- Coilover Suspension - $2,300
- Matt Black Paint Job ( Inc Engine Bay) - $3,000 (hookups again)
- Cream Leather/Suede Interior - $3,500
- Twin 12" Subs Replacing Rear Seats - $1,000
- Sparco Racing Seats x2 and Harnesses - $2,000
- 8 Pistion Racing Brakes - $5,000
- Upgraded Master Cylinder - $300
- Billet Grill - $1,000
- Half-Cage - $1,500
- Custom Guage Cluster - $1,000
- Misc Crap and some other labour $4k

So total of $79,200

And those prices are very very overpriced... Could well come in $10k under this.

My partner and I are doing it together... She loves V8s so she is drooling over this...

Her father is a qualified and very experienced Welder and Panel Beater.

Ending up with a 700hp ish Tough as nuts RWD FTO with a few old school touches (Billet grill and billet Rims) that wont overheat, underfuel, etc and is comfortable to drive to the drag strip, pull a 10 sec pass then drive home...

Our Main goal..... 100% Road Rego'd.... Which is one thing we are a must about...

Also, a teaser of what we want it to sort of look like (inc supercharger air intake)

koolio1234 · Post by **koolio1234** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:50 am

I like the idea of a RWD fto, not sure how the fto will be able to handle a 800hp 1uz/1jz, traction might be an issue as well as balance due to the massive weight at the front.

Have you considered doing a 6a13 swap with a RWD conversion?
Wont be as front heavy, more compatibility with the fto and will be heaps fun with RWD.

I understand that the 1uz/1jz might be more unique, but the 6a13 will be easier to install + the fact that you'd be going down the RWD route is different in itself.

scremn · Post by **scremn** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:17 am

Fitting any Mitsi engine which is normally transversely mounted would not be easier to install then another engine which is longitudinally mounted from factory. What are you doing for the front subframe Sam? Silvia?

It seems this is going to turn out being a dedicated racecar with a cage etc so why not transversely mount a V8 where the backseat is? Could use Mitsi's 4.5L 8A80 engine or the Ford Taurus SHO 3.4L. That should help balance out the weight

FtoSam · Post by **FtoSam** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:32 am

A 1UZ Engine WITH a gearbox on it is only 248kg total.... maybe 60kg heavier... which will be almost exactly offset by the rear end setup... SO weight balance will be about perfect....

And half cage = legal

Cant go bigger than a 4L V8 because of legalities...

And an East-West engine to go RWD is a pain in the Arse... All the RWD Evos have their engines turned North-South...

Ed_EViL · Post by **Ed_EViL** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 9:07 am

DUDE!!!!

I just JIZZED in my pants!!!

i would really like to see this, the first FTO muscle car

Post by **Bennoz** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 9:49 am

Awesome

Doin' it for sake of doin' it.

Well, my thoughts take me back to my V8 days.

With 800HP dont f**k around with Jap sh*t. I'd be heading straight down to Street Machine head quarters.

The FTO chassis will fold faster than Superman on laundry day with that sort of power... 800HP is fine, but you'll end up 1000+ NM of torque - it'll open up the FTO like can. You'll need a tube frame.

Ring John Taverna Chassis' & get a quote on a full tube chassis.

And I wouldn't f**k around with Syline rear ends either. There's only 1 solution for something like this:

Jag rear end with inboard discs so you can fit some filthy big Mickey Thompsons in. Nestled in the middle, an unbreakable Ford 9 inch diff

col2560 · Post by **col2560** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:04 am

^^^^^^^^^ what he said !!!! all that muscle car gear has been proven to withstand real horsepower many times before.

$80,000 is a serious build budget, you sure it will be street legal?? glad i'm not your engineer!!!!

although i have seen a 351 in a 1300 escort and a 350 chev in the front of a vw beetle, so anything is possible.
this build will dominate this site for sure !!!

alekazam · Post by **alekazam** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:17 am

there is already a 4L v8 FTO with a jag diff for sale on e bay for $38000 its called an
XK8

<a href="http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f303/ ... 01_opt.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f303/ ... 01_opt.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/1997-Jaguar-XK8- ... 286.c0.m14

Cassf88 · Post by **Cassf88** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:23 am

alekazam wrote:there is already a 4L v8 FTO with a jag diff for sale on e bay for $58000 its called an
XK8
<a href="http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f303/ ... 01_opt.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f303/ ... 01_opt.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
http://cars.ebay.com.au/JAGUAR-XK8-SPOR ... temZ600978

O.....M.......God! thats is like, OHHHHHH!

i want it ..... soooo ... BAD!

*yummmmmy*

harry90 · Post by **harry90** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 3:40 pm

FtoSam wrote: Also, a teaser of what we want it to sort of look like (inc supercharger air intake)

That looks AMAZING !!!

col2560 · Post by **col2560** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:38 pm

any one wanna watch re-runs of MAD MAX ???

FtoSam · Post by **FtoSam** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 5:25 pm

i dont think i should need a tube frame... between front and reat heavy strut braces, coilovers, roll cage and underbody support it should handle the 1,400nm of torque we're expecting....

Post by **Bennoz** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:37 pm

FtoSam wrote:i dont think i should need a tube frame... between front and reat heavy strut braces, coilovers, roll cage and underbody support it should handle the 1,400nm of torque we're expecting....

lol

I seriously doubt it. Strut braces & roll cages are only as strong as the chassis they are connected too & coilovers have nothing to do with chassis strength. 1400Nm's will pop every spot weld in it. I had a 1978 Chrysler Sigma as my fisrt car, after blowing the old 2.6L Astron motor, we shoe horned a 327 Chev into it making 400hp & about 600Nm of torque. First time down the strip with slicks on, I barked that hard off the line I was up on 3 wheels. I ended up driving the bent car home sideways as a targa top. Split it from seam to sill.

Seriously, it something thats not that expensive & it will also provide opportunity to design the rear to fit whatever diff setup you like in it. Espeically considering you'll be cutting up the floor pan anyway to fit a driveshaft tunnel in & space to fit the gearbox between the seats. You'll eliminate the need to buy a rear end outta something, be just a matter of picking your diff.

koolio1234 · Post by **koolio1234** » Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:54 pm

The tube chassis is definitely someting to think about.

Got a question though:

How serious are you about doing a project like this? Is this just a little bit of hypothetical talk OR is it a genuine project that your willing to seriously consider and finance? Just curious..