Another Wheel-related question

[Taz]

Hey guys
Im doing another round of researching all the small things for Maverick like racing batteries etc and i started thinking about rims, as ive come across a few good deals lately that ive passed up because im still not completely sure what i will require.
I know next to nothing when it comes to technical chit about rims like offset.
My question is - if i were to go with an 18" rim, and looking for maximum clearance for big brakes etc and to fill a widebody kit up, what ballpark figures are we talking? What kind of offset will that require, are spacers needed or if i order specific rims in will that eliminate the need? Im also looking to shove the biggest possible tyres under the guards as well, maybe 10.5" (keeping in mind i will have a bit more room than a stock fto guard and am not restricted to 'legal' modifications)
Sorry for being such a noob, but id rather ask here before i spend a good 1-2 hours at a rim shop looking like a dick and taking advice of someone who MIGHT know what theyre talking about and speak from experience, not commission

[Daniel2019]

Back onto wheels, Phunkydude runs 18s doesnt he?

Are you going to be pulling out the plastic wheel arch lining/have you pulled it out? How much lower are you planning on having the car? (Im guessing fairly low because track)

What size brakes are we talking here? i.e. Evo upgrade? Evo upgrade might be an idea mate. If its good enough for Bennoz then it's good enough for most of us

Everything you need is on an Evo 5, all bolt on. However I had to fiddle a bit to get the bits I need, as the wrecks only had certain bits.

Control arms:
- Evo IV and V are a direct fit. You need these because of the ball joint fitting on the bottom of the hubs.
- Evo III is the same basic control arm (minus the sway bar link area on the arm (which to us is a GPvR style) however the ball joints are the same as FTO (and Magna lol) which do not meet up to the hubs we need to use for this.
These were the only arms I could get today, so I bought the Evo IV/V ball joints & pressed them in myself.
- FTO arms. Yes! You can use them, however you need to press out the ball joints & use 'modified' Evo IV/V ball joints. They will sit too high if you just press them in normally.

Hubs:
- Must be Evo V. As you can see by the pics, they have the correct mounting space for the Brembos. Evo VI and up use yet another ball joint fitting which wont fit in the early style arms, so they're no good. The Evo IV never had Brembos, they used a caliper similar to GPX, so no good for us.
- ABS is available in these hubs, just in a different position, so all good for those with ABS
- Check the condition of the wheel bearings in the hubs. Evo V wheel bearings are f**king expensive

Control Arm Bushes:
- The front bush is the same as all FTO's. Same aftermarket poly bushes will fit too
- The rear bush is the same as a GPvR. The same aftermarket vR bushes will fit (I have some on order lol)

The full kit..



Difference between Evo II, III, ball joint versus Evo IV, V ball joint.



Evo III control arms with Evo IV/V ball joints pressed in



Evo V hub



The little bolt that holds on the dust cover (Evo V hub) which as you can imagine is being ripped off & binned.



Comparison of FTO arms & hub, versus retro fitted Evo III arm (Evo IV/V would have been direct fit) and Evo V hub.
Note the difference in rear control arm bushes, that's because I didn't run GPvR bushes. I do now because of this

Keeping in mind that Ben had to run 20mm spacers with 18 x 8 with 38 offset rims and it only just fits up.

So, bearing that in mind, if you do go for that brake upgrade you shouldnt have too much of a problem in terms of brake clearance.

In terms of rim width I'm not really sure. If you can run a bigger spacer (if youre running them at all) or more offset then you can fit more tyre and rim under there before you start to scrub.

Also, might be some more info in here - http://ftoaustralia.com/v3/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15108 *shrug*

[Daniel2019]

Moar info! Prices for brakes. Keeping in mind these are used.

I paid $1200 for all of this (some $400 cheaper than the whole UAS kit.. grumble grumble grumble lol.)

Apparently, if it was not mates rates, they quoted me at least $1600 (the wreckers (SSS automotive @ Giraween) that supplied all this for me)

Hope that info helps at least a little bit

Edit: And the other point that Shane001 made is that rim design is also a factor. i.e. Ben's rims are slightly convex which means that the outside is a bit further in towards the brake caliper then the middle, so if you were to get a set of rims with a flatter design then you can save yourself some more space.

[Taz]

actual content in a post!

I do plan on eventually doing an evo 5 conversion, and have eyed off Bennoz example since he has done it haha, but i also plan on doing 10-10.5" rims - which i assume will be a different ballpark. He also had minor clearance problems as well if i remember correctly?
I will be removing anything that will get in the way
What i want to know is, can i get away with no spacers but at the same time run enough offset to get around a big brake kit - and if thats possible do those kinds of rims exist?
As ill probably be ordering from a catalog or online i wont have much opportunity to discuss it over with someone who can help in person, and thought if someone on here knows enough about this or has even talked to/researched it themselves they can share some of the wisdom. Last thing i want to do is order the wrong rims and be stuck with a set of expensive/massive rims that have a slim to no market.
Never bothered to understand technicalities of different rims so i dont know sh*t when it comes to the subject.

[Daniel2019]

actual content in a post!

I do plan on eventually doing an evo 5 conversion, and have eyed off Bennoz example since he has done it haha, but i also plan on doing 10-10.5" rims - which i assume will be a different ballpark. He also had minor clearance problems as well if i remember correctly?
I will be removing anything that will get in the way
What i want to know is, can i get away with no spacers but at the same time run enough offset to get around a big brake kit - and if thats possible do those kinds of rims exist?
As ill probably be ordering from a catalog or online i wont have much opportunity to discuss it over with someone who can help in person, and thought if someone on here knows enough about this or has even talked to/researched it themselves they can share some of the wisdom. Last thing i want to do is order the wrong rims and be stuck with a set of expensive/massive rims that have a slim to no market.
Never bothered to understand technicalities of different rims so i dont know sh*t when it comes to the subject.

Yeah, I dont know a lot about prices in terms of rims. Your best bet would be second hand and you can save yourself some cash there. Of course new, shiny and free from battle scars from punch-ons with gutters is always better, but its also 2, 3, 4x the price of second hand. If I were you I'd find a set of used ones in the size you're looking for (who cares if theyre scratched, as long as theyre not buckled/flat/whatever) and just re-paint them.

Put it this way, theoretically Ben had to add 20mm of space for his wheels to fit, right? This was with slightly convex rims (check my edit in above post ^). So factoring that in you will need at least 17-18mm more in offset to make up for the spacers if you were to run a completely flat rim of the same thickness in design (Or even 20mm to be safe, I dont know how convex his rims are). (Also if anything I'm saying is wrong, someone who knows what theyre doing feel free to yell at me).

In the perfect world, if youre buying second hand rims locally, I'd see if I were able to test fit them if I were you But I understand that might not be the case. Just a thought/suggestion.

[bjk]

I don't know much technically either, but I have looked at wheels, so this is just an fyi I guess. Rota makes their 'Boost' wheel in 18x10 et20.
http://www.rotaaustralia.com.au/rota-bo ... 047074.htm Apparently has good brake clearance.

Another et20 but 10.5" http://www.rotaaustralia.com.au/rota-for ... 280034.htm

Can probably look for yourself on the site if interested, quite a number of width/offset combinations. Hope this is somewhat useful.

[Taz]

Daniel - i dont know where he lives anymore otherwise a good head smacking is what he would of gotten by now
I dont think im going to be that lucky finding a set of second hand rims that will suit. Its a pretty uncommon rim size and offset ill be looking for. Ive accepted that im going to have to order some rims (although it would be fkn fantastic if i dont have to)

Bjk - yea ive had a browse at some Rotas, but at over 6k for a set of rims im very hesitant - maybe im dreaming but i want to get a set under 3-3.5 if i can. Dont give a crap about brand names etc as long as they do the job. I have no idea what ballpark of offset ill even need either.

Ive still got to pick the CAMS handbook apart and see if i can use any kind of spacer and if so how much, might do that today (its a fkn thick book)
In any case, thankyou to both of you for actually helping and not being another asshole like B1 and B2 over there...

[Daniel2019]

Daniel - i dont know where he lives anymore otherwise a good head smacking is what he would of gotten by now
I dont think im going to be that lucky finding a set of second hand rims that will suit. Its a pretty uncommon rim size and offset ill be looking for. Ive accepted that im going to have to order some rims (although it would be fkn fantastic if i dont have to)

Ive still got to pick the CAMS handbook apart and see if i can use any kind of spacer and if so how much, might do that today (its a fkn thick book)
In any case, thankyou to both of you for actually helping and not being another asshole like B1 and B2 over there...

For offset, if Ben is running +38 then you will need pretty much equal to, or more than that. You never know, you might get lucky and find them second hand. It's worth a try anyway and I'm guessing you have a little while to find a set. May as well have a go and see, cant do any harm.

As for CAMS regulations.. NFI mate

Edit - You could try Yahoo Japan Auctions or companies like Import Monster that list that kind of thing on their site. Might be easier to find a set on there than locally. Only problem would be shipping costs but if you can get them cheap then it may be worth it.

[Taz]

finally found some useful information


1. RIM WIDTH
The maximum rim width may be prescribed in category or class regulations.
If a steel centre is used, the following restrictions apply subject to the maximum specified in the category or
class regulations.
(a) Racing Cars of the 1st Category and Sports Cars (Group 2A and 2C):
(i) up to and including 2000cc capacity: 8.5”
(ii) over 2000cc capacity: 10”
(b) Other automobiles of the 2nd Category and Touring Cars of the 3rd Category:
(i) when a steel wheel centre supplied by a vehicle manufacturer as original vehicle equipment is used, any
rim attached to such centre shall not be more than 2” wider than the rim originally fitted to such centre.
(ii) when a steel wheel centre other than that supplied by a vehicle manufacturer as original vehicle
equipment is used, no widening is permitted.

7. WHEEL SPACERS
A maximum of one metallic spacer may be used behind each wheel.

So basically, i dont have restrictions when it comes to rim width, and i can use one wheel spacer on each rim.
Will it be far easier to just whack on a spacer to make up for offset? How big can a spacer be whilst still being safe? 20mm? more?

[aza013]

It would come down the the length of the wheel studs you have on the car. In saying that you can use the spacers that bolt onto the hub and they have there own studs on them for the wheels. Check Ben's thread for more info as he is running these spacers.

[Bennoz]

9" is the max you'll fit. I've got 8s & a 235 tyre & they used to rub on the inside, when spaced out 20mm, they rubbed on the outside pre gaurd rolling.

[Taz]

9" is the max you'll fit. I've got 8s & a 235 tyre & they used to rub on the inside, when spaced out 20mm, they rubbed on the outside pre gaurd rolling.

Doesnt matt have 9.5"?

Keep in mind i will also have an extra inch or two to play with as well as i intend to widebody the car. Im hoping for 10.5 on the rear 9.5 on the front.

[Bennoz]

9" is the max you'll fit. I've got 8s & a 235 tyre & they used to rub on the inside, when spaced out 20mm, they rubbed on the outside pre gaurd rolling.

Doesnt matt have 9.5"?

He does, but doesn't run 235 x 45 tyres. If you're going racing, douchebag stance is not what you want, max rubber on the road is what you want.

If you cut the guards to widebody. then fine, go as wide as your kit will allow.

[Taz]

im not a fully hektic c**t wanting MOAR CAMBER because thats the current fad.

Will having semi's make any sort or a difference? Ive always had the illusion that the tread pattern on the is not as 'thick' and therefore slightly smaler than a conventional tyre diameter.

In any case, i do intend to cut the guards to some degree, however i will still lower it as far as she'll go so they kind of cancel each other out in a way

Guess the only way to see is test fit some rims after the panel work is done

[aza013]

Well if you are still at my mum's house come out at test fit my wheels 235/45/17's .

[Astron_Boy]

Well if you are still at my mum's house come out at test fit my wheels 235/45/17's .

flol.

[bjk]

Hey Taz, not sure where you were looking at the Rotas. On the Aus site (one I linked earlier) it has sets of four 18 inch wheels that seem to top out at about $1500.

[Sahin]

Hey Taz, not sure where you were looking at the Rotas. On the Aus site (one I linked earlier) it has sets of four 18 inch wheels that seem to top out at about $1500.

Rota's = Heavy
Heavy = Bad

[bjk]

Hey Taz, not sure where you were looking at the Rotas. On the Aus site (one I linked earlier) it has sets of four 18 inch wheels that seem to top out at about $1500.

Rota's = Heavy
Heavy = Bad

Admittedly, yes. I'm guessing Taz was probably looking at Volks if he got a figure of 6k.

[silverGPX]

If I wanted to hard out track, id buy another set of wheels, and put them on everytime I went out.